SPS-286: How to Create a Book Trailer with Book Brush - with Corey Alderin
Speaker 1: On this edition of The Self-Publishing Show.

Corey Alderin: The process of getting it so that users think it's easy and they think they can do it, that's been the biggest challenge. So we have been refining it and taking in feedback from our current beta testers. We want authors to feel like they can create these if they want to.

Speaker 1: Publishing is changing. No more gatekeepers, no more barriers, no one standing between you and your readers. Do you want to make a living from your writing?

Join indie bestseller, Mark Dawson and first-time author James Blatch as they shine a light on the secrets of self-publishing success. This is The Self-Publishing show. There's never been a better time to be a writer.

James Blatch: Hello, it's Friday. And it's the self-publishing show with me James Blatch.

Mark Dawson: And me Mark Dawson.

James Blatch: I have to apologise, my lighting is broken. In the old days you had a light switch, didn't you? Now we have an app and a hub somewhere and it's one of my children's disconnected it to plug in something. And now I can't change it. So I'm red. John might be able to tweak it in post-production, but I'm normally the correct colour.

Mark Dawson: And I have very bad lighting because I'm in the home office, not in the office office.

James Blatch: This is good job that most people listen to this podcast.

Mark Dawson: It is. Because we look very unprofessional today.

James Blatch: We've let the lighting down. Good. Yes.

Well, we are in the UK, which is currently going through its third wave, which is a silent wave, it's not causing huge amounts of damage in hospitals, but my children are all... It's unbelievable what's gone through in our school. I don't know if you've had the same thing. So Emily's isolating, she's sent off for a test. She's been negative on the lateral flow test, but lots of her friends have tested positive.

Our friend's daughters have tested positive, and they, I think, are eight people left out of 60 in one of the year groups in school. Suddenly, it's ripping through the school children in this country, although it's not causing any damage, thankfully. And most of them barely know they've got it, but it's suddenly everywhere. I'm talking about the virus by the way.

Mark Dawson: Yes. Freya finishes school today, so she's off her last day today and then Samuel is off next week. Well, she will do it as much as they can, I guess. Although, we're talking about this with Lucy last night with kids getting it is such a... They need to get it to get to the level they think they need in order to suppress it.

James Blatch: Yes. There's a lot of discussion about exactly that at the moment, but yeah, so hopefully wherever you are in the world, it's not too bad. The vaccines, I can tell you, just looking at the facts, the vaccines are the winning ticket here because in France, across the sea, not that far away from us, they haven't progressed anything like as far with their vaccine programme and the number of people in intensive care and dying from the virus as a proportion is dramatically higher than it is in the UK.

They have a couple thousand cases a day and 40 or 50 people dying a day. We're having 12, 14, 15,000 cases a day and 10 to 20 people in hospitals. So the vaccines are the way forward with that. But we are still in that kind of post COVID era, I think from the economy point of view, there's definitely a shift on towards the digital world.

And we've said this before, we're authors, we operate as indie authors primarily digitally. Not exclusively, but primarily digitally. I don't think there's many authors who rely on the physical side of books for a big chunk of their income. And so in a way we are well-placed hopefully to protect ourselves, at least, from a big downturn in the industry. And of course, you are a physical author, you are an actual author, yeah. But you do have physical books.

Are they an important part of your income? Or they sort of shop window for you?

Mark Dawson: No, they have been. The Cleaner in hardback and paperback did really, really well. Had a very nice check for that not too long ago. The second book Saint Death didn't do quite as well, so we're not quite sure why that is. Who knows really?

When The Cleaner came out, shops had just reopened kind of. The circumstances were a little bit different when the second one came out, so we don't know quite how that affected it, whether the cover was right. It's very hard to say. So it's done okay, but not as well as the first one. So yeah. There's that.

But then I've had two releases this month, one in German and the 19th Milton book, and they've both done really well. So I mean the German one is just kind of racing away. It's in the top 100 in Germany and has been for a couple of weeks.

And the Milton book launched... Actually, I was in The Bookseller this week in their book stat chart as the fifth highest ebook selling books that methodology of that week. So that was great and that's going really well. So it's been a pretty good month in terms of sales. Certainly no complaints there.

James Blatch: Good. Yes. And I've had a good June with my one book. I think I made £127, something like that over June and signed up just over two people a day onto my mailing list.

Mark Dawson: Yeah. It's very good.

James Blatch: Yeah. I'm really pleased with that. Seems to have followed the pattern I discovered, which is to really optimise the Facebook ads and I can make a small profit every day. I scaled up a little bit just by a couple of quid and that seems to have worked, but there's only four days.

I haven't looked at it yesterday yet, but three days, I think, before yesterday. It may have just been a coincidence, there was a bump in sales. It can be done with one book. It'd be an exciting prospect for me. And what would be really nice is to have a few minutes here and there to write the second book, which I think I had two writing sessions in the last seven days, which is not going to get the baby bathed.

Mark Dawson: I've never heard that before. No. That's that's true. There's lots going on. I'm quite extensively involved in Facebook ads at the moment in the UK, US, Canada, Australia, France, and Spain. So we're testing different variations, different audiences and getting some pretty decent CPC rates. And in the UK, it's going really well, actually. I've put The Cleaner and the first Atticus book to 99 pence. And they're selling really strongly.

Atticus has been in the top 150 for about two and a half, three weeks. And is driving sales of the second book, it's really clear. The second book has had a very long tail of when I launched it. And I'm sure that's because people are buying the first one cheap, enjoying it, and then immediately buying the second one, which it's still cheap. It's still only 1.99, so it is an impulse buy.

I should probably sit down and work out what the read through is, but I think it's probably quite high. And I'd love to write another one. I'm contracted with the audiobook production to write a third one, and I really want to write one fast, but I've got to write another Milton and then I'll get to Atticus probably at the end of the year.

James Blatch: Will they ever meet?

Mark Dawson: No. No, definitely not. No.

James Blatch: Different universe.

Mark Dawson: Separate universes. Yeah.

James Blatch: But it's both contemporary.

Mark Dawson: I know, but they're much too different. One's a detective, one's an assassin. No. Nope.

James Blatch: Yeah. I think at some point Hollywood's going to say to you, they're going to have to meet. Okay. Good. Right. Let's crack on with this week's interview.

It's a good one, it's with Corey Alderin from Book Brush. Book Brush is a tool that came along, a bit like Canva and Photoshop, but specifically for authors. And the specifics of it really are the key difference with Book Brush. If you haven't used it before, if you want to create something like a 3D box set, or cover up the... What's it called? Oh, I can't remember what it's called, but the slightly jazzier version of your cover, it's on a book.

You can drag and drop. It makes life very easy. Even someone like me can create a really good looking box set, and I have done for our few stuff. But they are not resting on their laurels, they're rolling out quite a lot of new changes. In fact, by the time this interview goes out, I think all the changes will be live, which Corey talks about in this interview. So worth listening to and catching up and at some point having a play with Book Brush yourself. Here's Corey.

Corey Alderin, welcome back to the Self-Publishing Show. It's been a while, hasn't it? I think you were on maybe year before last.

Corey Alderin: It has been awhile. Thanks for having back.

James Blatch: You're welcome. Book Brush has gone from being kind of a new kid on the block to a firm fixture, I think, in the indie publishing space. And I guess maybe widen that as well. I don't know.

Actually, there's a clue in the name. I was going to say. Does it lend itself to other things beyond books? But really, you focus on books, right?

Corey Alderin: It's all about books. That's everything. Authors use us for other things too in their personal life, but yeah, we focus all about books.

James Blatch: You could do business cards and stuff like that if you wanted, I'm sure, with your technology. And I guess that is one of the things that makes Book Brush useful is that it's easy to do what you need to do. So if you need to create a spine of a book... I think if you went into Photoshop and you needed to create the spine of a book, you'd have to have quite a lot of knowledge about dimensions and all this stuff set up and then how to manipulate texts. But that's what Book Brush delivers.

Maybe you should explain this better than I do, what the aim of Book Brush is.

Corey Alderin: Really, from the beginning, it's always been about helping authors create images very easily. So authors can hire somebody to do it and it's very expensive, but there are some ways from our end that we can make it very easy for authors to create something that already looks nice very quickly, easily.

Anything related to creating social media images or things for your email or really anything related to images that an author can think about, they can do in Book Brush and we have lots of ways of making that very simple for them.

James Blatch: And this is not academic to me anymore because since we last had you on the show, I am a published author, amazingly. Amazing. But I'm also a publisher. We publish other people's books. So I have had to go into Book Brush and use it. And in fact, I will send an image to John so he can put up on the screen now, this is a pack shot. So the box set that I did.

Honestly, unless you've done this, you will not believe how easy it is to make what looks like a very, very professional looking box set image just from having the covers available. I think I was helped by having the covers with no text on them as well. Stuart sends those to me.

I think that's essential this day and age. If you get your covers done, ask the designer, it's part of the deal, if he'll send them without the title, author name, and taglines, whatever on there. Gives you some background image. But actually, I think the first time I did it, I did have a text and I still found it easy to structure and manipulate and use that as background image and, well, the results speaks for itself. I think it looks pro.

Corey Alderin: Awesome. I will say that the team has done a great job of putting 99% of the box set, for example, the images is your book and the 3D effect, right? So our team has done a great job of creating that 3D effect. And when you combine them together, almost never do you have to actually manipulate the image. Like you said, if you have the image that you want fits together perfectly.

James Blatch: That works really well. And you can spend your time just fine tuning it, so it's all lined up and so on. Although I think it wasn't like that and I said to Stuart, "I'm not sure if one of these is lined up." He said, "It doesn't matter." He's a professional designer who does this day in, day out. He said, "If you look at that and it looks great, that's what matters."

He said, "Don't get bogged down in millimetres with graphic design." But yeah. So I think it's put that level of professional, and it is graphic design ultimately, in the hands of amateurs, which is you and me being able to do it, as you say, and that's a cost saving in terms of using professionals.

You obviously run the support side of Book Brush as well there.

Do you find that authors without experience of using this type of software are able to use it easily? Or do you end up supporting people through the process?

Corey Alderin: It varies depending on the type of author, of course. If you've got an author who goes straight to our templates, it's almost impossible to mess up because it's very simple. You load a template that you like, that looks great for your book, all you do swap out your cover, right? And couple of switches.

There are some pieces as you get a little bit more complicated. We try to do everything very easy, but have the options in case authors want to do these other things. And so sometimes authors will ask us, "Oh, I saw this really cool effect that an author did on their image. Is that possible to do here?" And so we walk people through.

We actually have classes too, so when things like that come up a lot, Kathleen, who is head of our support and all of that, she puts together a course on it and gets people in their live asking questions. We help the author as much as they need throughout the whole process.

James Blatch: How's it going for the company point of view? This started as, I guess, you must've quit your day jobs to make this work. And has it paid off?

Corey Alderin: It's been doing great. It hasn't slowed down since, I think, we launched 2018, early 2018. So things have just been on the rise. In 2018, probably not long before we actually met you guys at NINC, it was just three of us doing it. Two of us doing it full-time and since, every year we've been growing and adding. We're up to nine people on the team now doing various things.

James Blatch: And you all work from home?

Corey Alderin: Yes. We're across the globe, mostly in the US, but across the globe. Nobody's in the same... Well, we've got a couple of people that are kind of close to each other, but for the most part all interaction online.

James Blatch: Yes, the modern way. And what do you do, Corey? I think you're a developer yourself, you've done some of the coding in the early days.

Corey Alderin: Yeah. So when it first started, I was the only developer on the team. I started everything from scratch. That's still my main focus. Half my time, at least, is devoted to continuing that, managing the team. And then the other half is doing some other stuff related to growing the business. Some podcasts.

James Blatch: Podcasts. I was going to say, how do you grow the business? Do you run any paid ads anywhere?

Corey Alderin: We do some paid ads on Facebook. We've done things on YouTube channels, things like that. Those have been our two biggest ones that have been helpful so far, and some conferences.

James Blatch: Yes, of course. I think it always pays off to have actual physical presence and talk towards us.

Corey Alderin: Yeah.

James Blatch: Definitely. We're looking forward to doing that again maybe this year, hopefully.

Let's talk about the developments then since we last spoke. In fact, I think maybe even the box set image was enhanced since we spoke before.

Corey Alderin: Since the last time there could be quite a few things, actually. We are adding things quite quickly. Some of the things maybe since we last spoke, like you said the box set creator, we've added a lot more options there. You've already touched on being able to create everything from the box set creator to create the box set.

We have a cover creator, which I don't know that we talked too much about before either. But the biggest thing about that, that authors really like is being able to convert their ebook version to their paperback version. Very simple. So we auto load Amazon's dimensions and we put all the lines, so you know exactly where the front cover and the back cover and the spine is supposed to go. So make it really simple.

The most basic use of it is an author taking their ebook cover, placing it on the front right there and then doing a few small tweaks to make a simple physical book. So really helpful for people who main focus is ebook, but they have the physical book as well.

James Blatch: That's really useful. And it is fiddly and will quickly get rejected if you don't get that right. Again, the dimensions. And that's exactly the sort of thing that people struggled with before. It's all very well having an idea for an image, but then getting those dimensions right, and then exporting it is also problematic. It's got to be PDF.

And I guess you make that easy because in fact, I did this just the other day with an old cover from Photoshop and actually exporting the PDF at the right resolution and size, because it always wants to resize it when you print it to PDF. Yeah. That's going to save a lot of headaches, I think.

Corey Alderin: Yep. Well, when we first started creating it, we heard a lot of people say, "We first thought Amazon had a basic one." And we're like, "Well, then we really need to create one." But we kept hearing people saying they were frustrated with even Amazon's. And so we decided to do that and it's been helping lots of authors.

James Blatch: I just shudder a bit at the prospect of the point of uploading your book in the KDP Bookshelf. And that's the one which you create your cover and you really need to sit quietly and do that before you're uploading and publishing your book. I think the big thing recently is video.

Corey Alderin: Yeah. So we've drastically upgraded video capabilities. For a long time we've had the ability to upload a video that goes behind, it gives a slight bit of movement here and an image, right? But we have drastically updated that.

And we now have what we call Trailer Creator. And it's currently in beta, potentially it will be released full here, maybe even by the time this goes live. But it really brings the same concept that we have for images of being able to, like I said, start from scratch and just swap out your book, and there you go, you have an image. You can adjust it if you want. We're doing the exact same thing for video. So we have one of our new hires is a videographer, he's been doing lots of video and media and stuff for many years. He's putting these together for us, which will be trailers for authors.

And all they have to do is add their book, download, and they have a trailer. Just like everything else that we have, like I mentioned before, you can adjust to exactly how you want. You can adjust the text, you can tell it when to slide in and when to slide out. The different transitions. You can adjust the transition. You can add different background videos, you can upload your own things like that to adjust it, to make it exactly your book.

So it has that full capability just like a full video software would that you would expect. But the big thing that is different about this compared to those is it's very author specific, just like our image templates are. And if you want something for your romance book, for example, we'll have a whole list of romance templates that you can pull up and it'll look nice right out of the box.

James Blatch: I saw you had a new hire, a video guy. So that is obviously an important direction for you to go in and it's something that authors ask about all the time. And again, I'm a video editor by my freelance days, but it is fiddly, more fiddly, I would say, than still manipulation video. Not everyone grasps it, the timeline concept and stuff.

I think simplifying that with the old template approach is going to be a boon to authors who are scared of going near Premiere Pro or whatever.

Corey Alderin: Yeah. And that's actually the part that's probably taken us 80% of our time on developing this. Creating it and the ability to do it was actually the simple part from a development side, but the process of getting it so that users think it's easy and they think they can do it, that's been the biggest challenge. So we have been refining it and taking in feedback from our current beta testers to really get that. That's the part is we want authors to feel like they can create these if they want to. And it is there, it's almost done and going to be released out of beta to everybody here soon.

James Blatch: It will probably be, I don't know, maybe three weeks or so, four weeks before this goes out. Do you think it will be live by then?

Corey Alderin: Yes, it will be.

James Blatch: Okay. I'm looking forward to playing with that then. I do have a video ad for my book, which has just been tweaked at the minute, but I will definitely be one for trying that out. And it sounds to me, Corey, like potentially we could also do an [SPFU 00:22:03] webinar on the video side of things, maybe once it's live. It's always helpful, I think, to have you demo it live and perhaps go through and create a trailer for it, you or one of your colleagues. We'll sort that out off air, get a date and the time if you don't mind.

Corey Alderin: Yeah. Absolutely. Because it's such a visual thing that people will understand it way better when they see it.

James Blatch: So then platform, you must've had some growing pains, I imagine. When you start with just a few people and then suddenly more and more people join the platform. I know what it was like from SPS point of view just providing online courses.

You've been scaling up and keeping up with all this?

Corey Alderin: Yeah. Well, like you can probably imagine, we've had some bumps in the road over the last few years, especially when we get these drastic increases of new users. Being able to manage and storing all the media. We've had a few times where it got close. It was like, "Oh, we're close. We need to get this done."

We've had some late nights getting the team on, on a last minute call to be like, "All right. We didn't see this happening today, but we have to do it today." So let's get this done. Fortunately, we've got a good team.

James Blatch: You work incredibly hard at it all.

Do you see any trends from where you are, Corey? Is there something you see authors asking for more that they didn't ask for a couple of years ago, anything like that?

Corey Alderin: Probably restating myself a little bit, but the whole reason we started video was just seeing more and more people wanting trailers. It's been a big thing recently. Even smaller things like adding audio, the little audio thing to your image because audio books are becoming really big, right? And so being able to share, I'll say, "images", they're not really images, but you can add this little movement of something on your image to make it...

Ads are becoming harder and harder, right? To stand out and so people are asking for things that move and make their book shaped or whatever, something like that, to make their books stand out a little bit more. Those have been the big things we've had.

James Blatch: That's been the main thing. I can understand that. So just going back to the video, just thinking about what would an author need?

Most authors perhaps have their cover and they might just have that even with the text on it. Is that going to be enough assets as it were for them to be able to use this video creation tool?

Corey Alderin: Yeah. At the very basic level, you want something that looks nice and you just have your book cover. But basically, you load up this template, like I was telling you. It's got the full scene already built in and you just a couple clicks and your book is in the placement of where the placeholder book is. We fill it in with our own text, but that can be swapped out really easily as well for them.

So something like maybe they're adding a review on one of them or one of the slides is a description of the book or multiple slides of leading up to the description of the book. They can adjust the text themselves.

James Blatch: So you've got a library of stock video. Did you commission your own stock video? Did you pull that off the shelf from somewhere?

Corey Alderin: We use a fairly common one. It's called Pixabay. The biggest reason we use that is it's free. Every single image and video on there you can use commercially. So you can use them in your ads, you can use them in your books, whatever. So we make it so that authors don't have to worry about that.

James Blatch: What was their business model then?

Corey Alderin: I think they work from letting people provide... What do you call it? Tips or something to the people. It's a small team that I think they make money off of ad revenue, if you go to the website, things like that.

James Blatch: So how much does it cost, Book Brush now, Corey?

Corey Alderin: We have a few different levels. The basic level, which gets you into creating all the images and all the templates for images is $100 a year. The next level up, which includes... Haven't really talked about this feature, it's an older feature, but it's a popular one, it's called Instant Mock-ups that gives you the ability to have your book kind of in real life, hands and real life visuals, I guess, that you can't quite do in a typical kind of image creation. That's at the about $150 level.

And then the Trailer Creator will be included on our $250 a year plan that we have.

James Blatch: Tell me about the mock-ups then. So you're talking about what are live images of humans, but they'll be holding your book?

Corey Alderin: Basically. The tool itself is very simple. You get this long list of, I think we're up to 1500 different images now, these real life photos. And you take your book, you flip your book, you click your images that you want, you say download, and you get as many as you want in this one nice file that you can use to then share wherever you want.

They range from, some people call them lay flats, where it's the book flat on a bed or a desk or whatever kind of your genre is with other things kind of in the mix. People holding the book, you see actors reading them, a popular one is a dog that has the book in its mouth, it looks like it's trying to give you the book, different things with audio.

James Blatch: And 1500 odd, so that you're not going to see... it'd be pretty unlucky to have it repeated with somebody else's book in the dog's mouth too often.

Corey Alderin: Exactly.

James Blatch: Well, the dog might be hungry.

Corey Alderin: Yeah. And then we had different genre specific ones too. So if you're in some of those then even less likely that for it to be mass produced out there.

James Blatch: Well, I'd say well I'm quite galvanised again, I haven't used Book Brush to do the box set, I need to get back on there and start playing with some of these things. Particularly, the video trailer. I would definitely have a go with that with a couple of the books we have going in Fuse. I've genned myself up before you come on for that webinar. Great.

What's next for Book Brush?

Corey Alderin: Yeah. Well, still got to get the video creator completely out, but after that, once that is out we're going to go back to focusing a lot on redoing the interface as we've grown.

We've grown a lot. We've got lots of different tools now, and we've touched on them all a little bit, but it's because there's so many different tools we've gotten some feedback that it's a little complicated getting around and knowing everything, what to use when to use it. So we're trying to make that whole process way easier for authors. So getting them to the tool they need for the specific use. So then they know about all the tools too.

James Blatch: That would be great. I hadn't noticed it particularly problematic on Book Brush, but it will be an inevitability as you grow. And honestly, it's a bugbear of mine in that companies... In fact, Amazon do this and lots of companies, when they grow they end up disparate and disjointed. You have to log in about five different little portals all over the place and they look different. They look and feel different.

I think keeping that unity as you go along and not being afraid to redesign. I'm not a developer, so I don't know how much this means, but even if it's just the front end, the back end could, I don't know, could stay the same, maybe. I think that's a really important part of keeping us up.

Apple do it very well. Apple always looks beautiful. Looking beautiful is a really important part of their software and I think that's a good ethos to have, personally.

Corey Alderin: We've been so focused on bringing up... This sort of interface isn't a thing you hear authors say like, "I need a better looking whatever." You don't hear those specific words, but we've been so focused on all these tools and different features and stuff that, like you said, it can start to feel a little bit siloed, all these different things. And so we definitely don't want it to be that way. Once they become silos, then it's harder for authors to get to the other tools and we want them to know about all these tools that they have access to.

James Blatch: Yeah. Or you want to keep people on the site and keep it useful as possible too through their career.

Corey Alderin: Yep.

James Blatch: Great. Okay, Corey. Well, hopefully we might see you in person this year. I think you came to London, didn't you? To our conference.

Corey Alderin: We did.

James Blatch: I remember having a chat with you on the packed boat, which we all shudder about now when we think.

Corey Alderin: We actually upped our flight home just a day early and got back the day before the whole thing went crazy here in the US. So we got back just in time.

James Blatch: That was absolutely bizarre. We all went home and that was it. We shut the front door and didn't appear again for nine months. That was incredible.

But it was great to chat to you, I think you came over with your wife. I remember chatting to you on the boat and that was really nice of you to see you then. Hopefully we'll see you, maybe.

I don't know if you're going to conferences this autumn?

Corey Alderin: The two that I know for sure we'll be at are NINC and 20 Books. So we've got those booked and we'll be there. Hopefully more, but a little bit up in the air.

James Blatch: Well, we'll be at those too. Pandemic willing.

Corey Alderin: Yeah.

James Blatch: Corey, thank you very much. Thank you for producing a really useful and very well put together service for authors. Growing as part of the indie community growing together. It's great to have you there. And we really appreciate it.

Corey Alderin: Absolutely. Thanks for having me too. It was fun.

James Blatch: Are you a Book Brush person, Mark? Have you used Book Brush?

Mark Dawson: Yes. It's excellent. There aren't many tools that I use and recommend, but that's definitely one of them. I don't use it that much because, again, I have to pick what I do and where I spend my time. And it makes more sense for me to have a pro doing that for me.

Stuart does all of my images, but Book Brush is really good. Remember we met them at NINC two years ago, it may even be three years ago now. I'm pitched stuff quite a lot and normally it's rubbish, but I could immediately see that what they had done it's kind of a white labelled Canva that's specifically aimed at what we need as authors. And I could see immediately that they were going to do quite well. And I think they have done well and adding products and features to the product all the time.

James Blatch: Yeah. The video stuff looks excellent. I'm definitely going to have a play with that as well. That was a strange noise, is that your dog?

Mark Dawson: Yeah. It's Scout, he's whining. I think his dog walker might be turning up, so people may hear a very excited dog in a minute.

James Blatch: Okay. Right. Well, on that dog walking note. I've been up since 5:00 in the morning dealing with a sick puppy just vomiting. Don't know why. Probably because he eats absolutely everything that's anywhere near him, including socks and knickers. Problematic puppy time.

Mark Dawson: Right. Yes.

James Blatch: So on that note, thank you very much indeed to our guest Corey Alderin. Checkout Book Brush. We do have a discount, I think, somewhere. If you go to selfpublishingformula.com and click on the resources tab, I think you'll probably find something there. And if you're on our courses, of course, you do get a discount, a VIP bonus into Book Brush. That's it for this week, I think. All that remains for me to say is this a goodbye from him.

Mark Dawson: And a goodbye from me. Goodbye.

James Blatch: Goodbye.

Mark Dawson: There he goes.

James Blatch: Cute.

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